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 Post subject: [RP Related] 1940s-1950s Weaponry & Equipment
PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2009 2:13 pm 

Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2009 7:57 pm
Posts: 647
Location: UK
Faction: Crimson Armada

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After a couple of incidents in RP lately I figured it might be beneficial to compile a list of firearms present in through the 1940s up to the late 1950s. My source is mainly world.guns.ru which seems to be fairly reliable, with occasional referencing against other websites and sources provided there.

I'll attempt to update the list as other information is acquired. Feel free to correct any errors if you have sources to back those corrections up. Country of origin is in brackets and the weapons are organized by country of origin rather than anything else.

Additionally, if I've missed anything, please note it down with a link from some source. Preferably focus on 40s to 50s rather than earlier weapons, although exceptions have been made in a couple of very long-lived weapons such as the Colt SAA and Browning M2. The cutoff date is ~1959.

Thanks to all who've helped me dig up new toys!

First things first:

Gun Safety Notes (This Is A Link!)

Read them, learn them, live by them.

As the article says: Ignore those that decry these rules; you will outlive them.

Handguns: Ah, the venerable sidearms and protectors of the peace. No pilot should take to the skies without one.
Revolvers: .44 Magnum rounds and cheesy quotes sold seperately. And let's face it, revolvers are just better.
Colt Model 1878 (US)
Colt 1873 "Peacemaker" (US)
Smith & Wesson Compact (J Frame) (US)
Smith & Wesson M&P Medium (K Frame) (US)
Smith & Wesson Large (N Frame) (US)
Colt Official Police (US)
Colt Police Positive (US)
Colt Detective Special (US) Alt. Link
Colt Python (US)
Smith & Wesson Model 10 (US)
Smith & Wesson Model 29 (US)
Smith & Wesson Model 36 (US)
M1917 Revolver (US)
Webley Series Revolvers (UK)
Enfield No 2 Mark 1 (UK)
Type 26 Revolver (Japan)
Rast-Gasser M1898 (Austria-Hungary)

Miscellaneous Revolvers:

Nagant 1895 (Russia)
The Nagant 1895 is an interesting thing for a revolver; pulling the trigger locks the cylinder forward with the barrel, preventing the gas from escaping. This means the 1895 is the only period-appropriate revolvers that can be suppressed effectively.

Webley-Fosbery Automatic Revolver (UK)
An unusual creation, a revolver that uses the force of firing and a grooved cylinder to cycle to the next chamber after firing, unlike a double-action revolver. It has a lighter pull than a double-action as a result, but never really took off.

Semi-automatic Pistols: Usually small and sometimes easily concealed, having a semi-auto to hand is always helpful.
Webley & Scott Series (UK)
Colt M1900 (US)
Colt M1902 (US)
Colt M1903 Pocket Hammer (US)
Colt M1903 Pocket Hammerless (US)
Colt M1911 (US)
Ruger Standard/MK II (US)
Colt Model 1903 (US)
Colt Model 1908 (US/Belgium)
Browning Hi-Power (Belgium)
FN M1900 (Belgium)
FN M1903 (Belgium)
FN M1910/M1922 (Belgium)
Baby Browning (Belgium)
Roth Steyr M1907 (Austria)
Walther P38 (Germany)
Luger P08 "Parabellum" (Germany)
Sauer 38H (Germany)
Mauser HSc (Germany)
Dreyse M1907 (Germany)
Walther PP/K (Germany)
HK-4 (Germany)
Bergmann-Bayard "Mars" (Germany/Belgium)
Korovin TK (Russia)
Tokarev TT-30 (Russia)
Makarov PM/M (Russia)
SIG P210 (Switzerland)
Obregon (Mexico)
CZ-22/24 (Czech Republic)
CZ-27 (Czech Republic)
CZ-38 (Czech Republic)
CZ-50/70 (Czech Republic)
CZ-52 (Czech Republic)
M57 (Serbia/Yugoslavia)
Nambu (Japan)
Nambu Type 14 (Japan)
Nambu Type 94 (Japan)
Le Français (France. No, really!)
MAS/MAC Mle. 1935A/1935S (France)
MAS/MAC Mle. 1950 (France)
Vis wz. 35 (Poland)
Beretta M1934 (Italy)
Beretta M1935 (Italy)
Glisenti Model 1910 (Italy)

Miscellaneous Semi-Automatics:
Mauser C-96 (Germany)
The C-96 is slightly unusual because it is capable of fully-automatic fire like a machine pistol, but was primarily intended as a semi-automatic.
Beretta 950 Jetfire (Italy/Brazil/US)
A compact .25 ACP sidearm, useful for those who wish to carry a concealed weapon.

Machine Pistols: They look like pistols, but can fire in a fully automatic fashion. Also, they're not big enough to be SMGs. Best used in short bursts.
Stechkin APS (Russia)
Steyr M1912 (Austria-Hungary)

Miscellaneous Pistols: These pistols are set apart from their kin in some way, be it functionality or action. These are pretty weird and wonderful things...
Welrod Silenced Pistol (UK)
The Welrod is a silenced and fairly concealable bolt-action handgun, with the magazine apparently doubling as the grip.

FP-45 Liberator (US)
The Liberator is a crude, single-shot "insurgency weapon" designed to allow resistance members to "liberate" weapons from enemy personnel.

Bechowiec-1 (Poland)
A simple machine pistol (or SMG, depending) designed and produced for the Polish Resistance, similar to the Blyskawica below.

Submachineguns: Shorter range and effectiveness, but handy if someone's closeby. Compact firepower - a favourite of paras, engineering personnel and vehicle crews.
Thompson SMG (US)
Reising M-50 (US)
M3 "Grease Gun" (US)
UD M42 (US)
Ingram M6 (US)
Owen (Australia)
AUSTEN SMG (Australia/UK; AU modification of STEN)
STEN Gun (UK)
Sterling L2 & L34 (UK)
Lanchester Mk.1 (UK)
MCEM-2 (UK, Experimental)
Schmeisser MP-18 (Germany)
Schmeisser MP-28 (Germany)
Bergmann MP-35 (Germany)
Erma EMP35 (Germany)
MP .38 and MP .40 (Germany)
Schmeisser MP-41 (Germany)
MP 3008 (Germany)
DUX M53/M59 (Germany/Spain)
Walther MPL/MPK (Germany)
Vigneron M2 (Belgium)
Carl Gustav M/45 (Sweden)
FPB m/948 (Portugal)
MAS-38 (France)
MAT-49 (France)
Hotchkiss "Universal" (France)
MGD PM-9 (France)
Gevarm D4 (France)
Villar-Perosa (Italy)
Beretta M1918 (Italy)
Beretta M1938 (Italy)
Beretta M12 (Italy)
Franchi LF-57 (Italy) (alt link)
PPD-40 (Russia)
PPSh-41 (Russia)
PPS-43 (Russia)
Sa vz. 23 SMG (Czechoslovakia)
ZK-383 (Czechoslovakia)
Nambu Model 1 (Japan)
Type 100 (Japan)
Uzi SMG (Israel) (mini and micro variants not available until 80s, no dualwield for you!)
Suomi M/31 (Finland)
Tikkakoski M/44 (Finland)
Madsen M45 (Denmark)
Madsen M/46, M/50, M/53 (Denmark)
Hovea M49 (Denmark)
W+F Lmg.-Pist 41/44 Furrer (Switzerland)
SIG MP-48, MP-310 (Switzerland)
SIG M1920, M1930 / Brevet Bergmann (Switzerland)
SIG MKPS/MKMS (Switzerland)
Rexim Favor (Switzerland)
Steyr-Solothurn S1-100/MP-34 (Switzerland/Austria)
Kiraly 39M, 43M (Hungary)
53M / K1 (Hungary)
Mors wz.39 (Poland)
Blyskawica (Poland)

Shotguns: Shotguns never really took off until after WW2 ended, and saw fairly limited usage in military forces for various reasons. They are no doubt a popular armament for repelling boarders, though.
Ithaca Model 37 (US)
Remington 11/Browning Auto-5 (US/Belgium)
Remington 870 (US)
Remington 1100 (US)
Winchester 1897 (US)
Winchester 1887/1901 (US)
Winchester 1912 (US)
Winchester Model 21 (US) Alt. Source
Browning Superposed (US)

Other Shotguns:
Marble Game Getter (US, Rifle/Shotgun combo)
Why settle for a rifle or a shotgun when you can have both? The Game Getter is an under/over combo, with a .22cal rifle on top and .410bore shotgun underneath. Best used for hunting, rather than defense.

Coach gun (US/AU/Others)
The "Coach gun" is not really a single weapon so much as a term for a vast 'family' of generic double barrel 12-gauge break action shotguns issued to stagecoach messengers as a defensive weapon. The sort of thing one might expect a hunter to use, a farmer might have to deal with poachers, or a bartender might use to intimidate unruly patrons.

Rifles: In all shapes and sizes, rifles tend to be slow firing relatively speaking, but decently accurate.
Bolt Action: All of these rifles require the bolt to be manually cycled after each shot, making their rate of fire slow, but their range and accuracy more than makes up for this, as they can use more powerful (more powder; therefore faster; therefore more accurate) rounds than other actions.
Mauser Gewehr 98 and Karabiner K98 (Germany)
SMLE Lee Enfield (UK)
M1903 Springfield (US)
M1917 Enfield (US)
Winchester Model 70 (US)
Carcano M91 (Italy)
MAS 36 (France)
Arisaka Type 38/Type 99 (Japan)
Arisaka Type 38 (Japan)
Arisaka Type 44 Carbine (Japan)
Arisaka Type 99 (Japan)
Type I (Italy/Japan)
Ross (Canada)
K31 (Switzerland)
Steyr Mannlicher M95 (Austro-Hungary)
Mosin-Nagant (Russia)
Vz. 24 (Czechoslovakia)
Krag-Jorgensen (Norway)
35M (Hungary)
43M (Hungary)
Madsen M1947 (Denmark)
FR-7, FR-8 (Spain)
Chiang Kai-shek (China)
Hanyang 88 (China)

Lever-Action Rifles: Using a lever just below the trigger guard to chamber new rounds rather than a bolt or gas operation. They are commonly used as hunting rifles, rather than weapons of war.
Marlin Model 1894 Carbine (US)
Marlin Model 336 (US)
Marlin Model Golden 39A (US)
Winchester Model 1892 (US)
Winchester Model 1894 (US)

Self-loading Rifles: These are all capable of semi-automatic fire at the very least, using energy released by firing to load a new round into the chamber.
M1 Garand (US)
M1 Carbine (US)
Winchester Model 1907 (US)
Johnson M1941 (US)
Pedersen T1 (US)
Farquhar-Hill (UK)
G/K 43 (Germany)
Gewehr 41 (Germany)
Gewehr 43 (Germany)
Meunier M1916 (France)
RSC M1917 (France)
MAS-1949 & MAS 49/56 (France)
SKS Simonov (Russia)
AVS-36 Simonov (Russia)
Tokarev SVT-40 (Russia)
Mondragon (Mexico/Switzerland)
Ljungman AG-42 (Sweden)
Hakim (Egypt)
FN SAFN-49 (Belgium)
ZH-29 (Czechoslovakia)
Vz. 52 & Vz/ 51/57 (Czechoslovakia)
Madsen M1896 (Denmark)

Sniper Rifles: A couple of the weapons here are 'reruns' as some weapons served in sniper roles as well as standard rifle roles. All they needed was a scope and a skilled user.
M1903 Springfield (US)
Lee Enfield/L39A1/L42A1 (UK)
Type 97 Sniper Rifle (Japan)
Mauser Gewehr 98 and Karabiner K98 (Germany)
Mosin-Nagant (Russia)

Assault Rifles: Assault Rifle is basically a straight translation of "Sturmgewehr", after the StG 44 that started the trend. These are the big brothers of submachineguns, and are deadly at short range.
Type 56 (Chinese AK clone)
Fedorov Avtomat (Russia) Fielded beginning in 1915, the Fedorov Avtomat is considered one of the very first prototype Assault Rifles ever adopted -- though the AK-47 below would steal its thunder by being one of the first true post-StG44 Assault Rifles.
AK-47 (Russia)
AKM (Russia)
TKB-408 (Russia)
TKB-517 (Russia)
MP43, MP44 and Sturmgewehr 44 (Germany)
Sturmgewehr 45 (Germany)
Volkssturmgewehr 1-5 (Germany)
Armalite AR-15 (US)
The AR-15 was developed in 1957 and the rights sold to Colt some time after. Colt started producing the AR-15 as the M16 during the mid-sixties, and then used the AR-15 name for semi-auto civilian rifles which came out later. In this case, we're referring to the original selective fire AR-15, rather than the 'current' semi-auto models.

Battle Rifles: NB: these are often mistakenly classified as ARs, but use longer shells such as 7.62x51mm NATO rather than the German 7.92x33mm "Kurz" (short) and similar.
FN FAL (Belgium)
M14 (US)
Armalite AR-10 (US)
HK G-3 (Germany)
CETME (Spain)
Sa vz. 58 (Czechoslovakia)
SIG SG 510 (Switzerland)
Madsen LAR (Denmark)
Beretta BM 59 (Italy)

Other Rifles: These rifles are set apart from their common brethern by any number of factors...
Fallschirmjägergewehr 42 (Germany)
The FG42 is a paratrooper weapon capable of being used as a light machinegun, a battle rifle, or even a sniper rifle, all at a moment's notice.

De Lisle carbine (UK)
An experimental silenced bolt-action rifle occasionally used by commando units. It is said that the sound of cycling the De Lisle's bolt-action is louder than the report it makes when firing, thanks to its use of the subsonic .45 ACP round. Only 129 were produced.

EM-2 rifle (UK)
An innovative weapon and perhaps the earliest bullpup design. Largely experimental and only produced in very limited numbers; only 59 were ever produced. Anything of this nature would likely be seen in the hands of League or Armada firearms designers, though the compact size (valuable in a plane or airship!) - and nature of politics, with no NATO interference - would perhaps lead to (much) wider adoption.

Colt Lightning Carbine (US)
A pump or slide action rifle made to complement the "Peacemaker" SAA. Listed due to having a decently sized production run.

/!\ ATTENTION!/ACHTUNG!/ATTENZIONE! /!\
Everything beyond this point is regarded as non-standard or otherwise unusual weaponry that WILL NOT be encountered on a daily basis, unless one happens to work in an armoury. This section is mostly meant as a guideline for "special situations".

Machine Guns: For those occasions when you need more dakka, machineguns do not disappoint. Unless they overheat or jam. Note that some MGs can fit into multiple categories depending on how they are mounted, which barrel is fitted, and how much ammunition they carry.
Light Machineguns: Almost always man portable, LMGs are squad-level support for the most part, although occasionally used as light AA too.
Johnson M1941/M1944 (US)
Browning Automatic Rifle (BAR) M1918 (US)
Lewis (US/UK)
Bren (UK)
Vickers-Berthier (UK)
Browning wz. 1928/IMG 28 (Poland)
Charlton Automatic Rifle (Australia)
Chauchat CSRG M1915 (France)
Degtyarev DP/DPM RP-46 (Russia)
RPD (Russia)
ZB vz. 26 (Czechoslovakia)
Vz. 52 / 52/57 (Czechoslovakia)
Type 11 (Japan)
Type 96 (Japan)
Type 97 (Japan)
Type 99 (Japan)
Mendoza M1934/RM-2 (Mexico)
FN Model D (Belgium)
Dror (Israel)
Hotchkiss Portable Mk. I/Benet-Mercie M1909 (France/UK/USA)

Medium and General Purpose Machineguns: Mounted on vehicles and in some cases light enough to be used for squad support, MMGs are hard to beat. Occasionally used as AA, especially on aircraft tailguns.
MG 34 (Germany)
MG 42 & MG 3 (Germany)
M60 (US)
FN MAG (Belgium)
Vickers (UK)
Vickers K (UK)
BESA (UK)
ZB 53 / Vz.37 (Czechoslovakia)
UK Vz.59 "Rachot" (Czechoslovakia)
Degtyarov DS-39 (Russia)
SG-42 Goryunov (Russia)
MG 51 (Switzerland)
Browning M1919 (US)
Colt Browning M1895 (US)
Schwarzlose MG M.07/12 (Austria-Hungary)

Heavy Machineguns: Almost always mounted on vehicles (or aircraft) due to excessive recoil. Mostly used for anti-infantry and light/medium anti-aircraft duties.
Browning M2 .50 cal (US)
AA-52 (France)
MG 131 (Germany)
Browning M1917/M1919
DShK/M (Russia)
Type 1 (Japan)
Type 3 (Japan)
Type 92 (Japan)
ZB-60 "BESA" 15mm (Czechoslovakia)

Anti-Tank Weaponry: Something heavily armoured in the way, and you absolutely have to blow a hole in it with something that a soldier can feasibly carry around? Call in the big boys.
Rocket Launchers: Lack of guidance is rarely an issue, but do be careful where you point it.
RPG-2 (Russia)
Offenrohr/Panzerschreck ATRL (Germany)
Panzerfaust Disposable Rocket Launcher (Germany)
Bazooka Family (M-1 to M-20) (US), M1, M9, M20
Type-4 (Japan)

Recoilless Rifles: More accurate than rocket launchers (especially the notoriously inaccurate RPG-2), RRs fire shells and have a powerful backblast to counteract the recoil. Just don't get caught in that backblast.
Carl Gustav Recoilless Rifle (Sweden) Alt Link
M18 57mm RR (US)
M20 75mm RR
7.5 cm Leichtgeschütz 40 (Germany)

Anti-Tank Rifles: Whilst originally used by most sides during the Wars, they were phased out as tanks started to employ heavier armour. Rare but extremely powerful. Using them on infantry is generally overkill.
Type 97 (Japan)
Boys (UK)
Lahti L-39 (Finland)
Mauser T-Gewehr (Germany)
Panzerbüchse PzB-33/PzB-39 (Germany)
Panzerbüchse PzB M.SS.41 (Germany)
Degtyarov PTRD (Russia)
Simonov PTRS-41 (Russia)
Solothurn S-18/1000 (Switzerland)
Maroszek Kb Ur wz.35 (Poland)
Carl Gustav m/42 (Sweden)

Misc. Anti-Tank Weaponry: Things that make tanks go boom, but don't fit in any of the other categories.
PIAT - Projector, Infantry, Anti-Tank (UK)
Panzerwurfmine AT Grenade (Germany)
Hafthohlladung AT Charge (Germany)

Grenades: Grenades - where would we be without them? Pull the pin, throw, and dive for cover. A surefire hit at parties and group occasions! Defensive (Fragmentation) grenades are meant to be used from behind cover to kill attacking troops, whilst Offensive grenades are meant to be thrown into enclosed spaces to deal with defenders.
Mk 2 Fragmentation Grenade (US)
M61 Fragmentation Grenade (US)
F1 Grenade (Russia - Offensive, France - Offensive, Australia - Defensive)
RGD-33 Offensive Grenade (Russia)
RG-42 Offensive Grenade (Russia)
RPG-43 AT Grenade (Russia)
RPG-6 AT Grenade (Russia)
Molotov Cocktail (Improvized Incendiary Grenade) (Finland)
Mills bomb Defensive Grenade (UK)
No. 76 Special Incendiary Grenade (UK)
Model 24 Offensive Grenade (Germany)
Model 39 Offensive Grenade (Germany)
Model 43 Offensive Grenade (Germany)
Type 10 Fragmentation Grenade (Japan)
Type 91 Fragmentation Grenade (Japan)
Type 97 Fragmentation Grenade (Japan)
Type 99 Fragmentation Grenade (Japan)

Grenade Launchers: Few and far between at this stage, but nevertheless occasionally present.
M7 Grenade Launcher for use with US M1 Garand Rifle (US)
Type 2 Grenade Launcher for use with Japanese Type 39 and Type 99 rifles. (Japan)
Type 10 Grenade Discharger (Japan) (The Type 10 can be thrown independent of it's launcher)

Mortars: Bridging the gap between grenades and actual artillery. In this case, the cm refers to the size of mortar shells fired. Used for infantry support where heavier artillery may not be available.
Light: Light and easily portable mortars.
5cm Granatwerfer 36 (Germany)
3.7cm Mortar Shovel (Russia)
5cm PM-38 (Russia)
5cm Type 89 Leg Mortar (Japan)
5cm Ordnance SBML (UK)
6cm M2 Mortar (US)

Medium:
8cm Granatwerfer 34 (Germany)
8.2cm 82-PM-37 (Russia)
8.2cm 82-PM-41 (Russia)
8.1cm M1 (US)
8.1cm Ordnance ML (UK)
8.1cm Type 97 (Japan)
9cm Type 94 (Japan)

Heavy: Barely man-portable, these mortars may even require vehicles for effective portability.
12cm Granatwerfer 42 (Germany)
10.7cm M2 (US)
12cm M1938 (Russia)
12cm 120-PM-43 (Russia)

Other: Other mortar-type weapons, but with a twist!
20cm Type 4 Rocket Mortar (Japan)

Explosives: Sometimes you can't wait for bulldozers and wrecking gear - that's when you break out genuine explosives. Time to blow this pop stand to kingdom come!
Trinitrotoluene, aka TNT
Dynamite
Composition B
C4

Odds 'n' Ends: This area is also for miscellaneous military gear that I don't have much info on yet, like flares and other useful gadgets.
Pyrotechnic Flare (General)
Far too many makes and manufacturers to even begin listing them, these devices are usually used for emergency signals. You can bet every plane probably has at least one flaregun and other flares handy.
M18 Smoke Grenade (US)
Fliegerfaust AA Rocket Launcher (Germany)
Probably the first man-portable AA weapon, this oddity never really took off, but it's here for archival and curiousity purposes.

Related Reading: This is for miscellaneous associated links rather than weapons.

Personnel Weapons and Equipment Related Reading; Useful Notes from TV Tropes and More:
Useful Notes: Gun Safety: Rule #1; always treat a gun as loaded, even when you know it isn't. Learn the rules, and ignore those who decry them; you will outlive those people.

Modern Battlefield Weapons: Covers most of the categories above in a little better detail, but with less information on the actual weapons in said categories.

Useful Notes: When You Need Something Dead: A briefer coverage of all the weapons you could ever want (or need), much like the link above.

Every Japanese Sword Is A Katana: There are plenty of different ones, actually, all with various applications.

Useful Notes: Swords: Sure, they're not as practical as a revolver or semi-auto, but they have this kind of charm, you know?

Useful Notes: Archery: Useful instructions on things you need to consider when using a hand-drawn bow of some flavour. Does not include crossbows.

Bang Bang BANG: Gunfire is not a loud, explosive noise that cannot ever be mistaken for anything else.

Silencers: On a related note, the modern world prefers to call them "suppressors" now, since they don't silence the sound of a gunshot nearly as well as Hollywood would like us to believe apart from one or two minor exceptions.

Noisy Guns: In real life, almost all guns are carefully designed, well-constructed tools that - provided they are well maintained - can last a lifetime. More importantly, they won't rattle like a piggybank when you shake them.

Shur Fine Guns: Guns will generally not discharge if dropped or when striking a hard surface with their safety off. Additionally, jams do not mean the gun is rendered permanently useless.

Short Range Shotgun: Shotguns do actually have a fairly appreciable effective range with shot... and then there's slug rounds.

Guns Do Not Work That Way Index: Because there are just too many misconception tropes to list here!

The Box o' Truth: Firearm ballistics. A good link for anyone interested in ballistics and what happens when you shoot things with other things. Covers things like trying to shoot out locks, why car doors make for poor cover, and many other fascinating subjects.

Forgotten Weapons: Useful information on old and obscure weapons such as the EM-2. Also check out their youtube channel which has videos of some weapons both in-use and some footage and explanation of maintenance for said weapons.

Aircraft Related Reading:
Air Launched Weapons: The types of weaponry you can expect to find on aircraft.

Plane Spotting: A Brief History of Aviation, and Information on Types of Aircraft.

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Marcus' Guns (NO REFUNDS!)


Last edited by Marcus Langley on Wed Apr 24, 2013 7:25 pm, edited 88 times in total.

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PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2009 3:26 pm 

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Hey, thanks for all the work! I'd been doing a little research into this myself for my character, but you've gone way beyond what I ever intended to do. Nice job!

I also found a pistol to better suit my character, the Stechkin APS.

Wikipedia's got a decent article, with sources: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/APS_Stechkin

One of those sources is world.guns.ru: http://world.guns.ru/handguns/hg22-e.htm

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PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2009 4:08 pm 

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I don't mean to rain on your well-written parade, but isn't this a fictional world in which this takes place? As in, we ought use references for the types of weapons, but to use actual, real-world analogues would be weird?


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PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2009 4:20 pm 

Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2009 7:57 pm
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Sildar wrote:
Hey, thanks for all the work! I'd been doing a little research into this myself for my character, but you've gone way beyond what I ever intended to do. Nice job!

I also found a pistol to better suit my character, the Stechkin APS.

Wikipedia's got a decent article, with sources: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/APS_Stechkin

One of those sources is world.guns.ru: http://world.guns.ru/handguns/hg22-e.htm


Cheers, I'll add that to the list now whilst I remember. :smile:

Alhaldi Misteno wrote:
I don't mean to rain on your well-written parade, but isn't this a fictional world in which this takes place? As in, we ought use references for the types of weapons, but to use actual, real-world analogues would be weird?


We should, yes, but for the sake of sanity and obviously the fact that that's something of a rather large leap no-one has yet taken, we have no "in-world" weapons of note.

I had, at one time, considered going through, making a bunch of companies and firearms, but quite frankly it's far easier to just use real-world firearms. As you can see there are many manufacturers and many many weapons to choose from, and whilst I'm sure I could have an equivalent breadth, many of the weapons would no doubt end up being cookie-cutter clones of one another, which is dull. In an initial draft of my character, all of my weapons used different names but were referenced to be similar to several real weapons. Eventually I decided to simply discard the renaming and use real-world weapons to prevent confusion.

It's easier on everyone in the long run (if someone says the name of a gun and you don't recognize it, you can go and look it up!) and helps prevent confusion. Nearly everyone will know what a Colt M1911 or Thompson M1A1 is, so it's easier to simply refer to them as such. Saying you have an M3 "Grease Gun" is easier than saying you have an "M4 SMG" and explaining that it's essentially an M3 "Grease Gun" every time someone asks.

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PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2009 4:37 pm 
Cinco de Mayo 2014

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What about harpoon guns?
:fear:
I'm actually serious, though.



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PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2009 5:04 pm 
RP Guide

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I think there's a little bit of leeway for "silly guns" like harpoon guns or the like. Similarly, if there are guns which could reasonably be expected to exist, although our own real life history doesn't include examples, feel free to use a little creativity.

Example: I have in the past (only once though) RP'd with a .50 sniper rifle. Technically they didn't exist until fairly recently in firearm history. This isn't because we couldn't make them in the 40's, instead it's a case of no one seeing a need for one until much later. The 50 BMG round (used in the M2 from WW2) turned out to be a great sniping round, something only discovered in the Vietnam era. So while we had the capability to create .50 cal rifles, it was simply lack of motivation that kept us from producing them. Does this lack of motivation exist in skyrates? That's tough to say, but I do know that the skytopian manufacturing capabilities are comparable to the same real life time period that could have put out a 50 cal sniper rifle.

In other words: All the parts needed to build something existed in the 1940's->All the parts needed to build something then exist in skyrates->It can be built in skyrates.

Now this is obviously a dark road if you wander too far down it. Just remember, if you're using the method to justify lightsabers, you're a dick.

And then there are of course the verboten technologies like jet engines, lasers, and advanced radar...make sure you don't stumble into those.

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PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2009 5:06 pm 

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This could also be considered a reference guide for those who want to be creative.

For example, we've had confirmation from the devs that automobiles exist, but no in-game examples have been provided. We do, however, have a rough technology level, and we can extrapolate from there.

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PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2009 5:25 pm 

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@Tilde: get me some relevant examples and I'll add some links for "exotic" weapons. :razz:

@Harris: an interesting way of thinking of things, but quite valid. Good justification there. :smile:

Summary of recent changes;
Added a bunch more grenades and some anti-tank weaponry. I might split RRs off into their own category in the near future. Grenades have been clarified as "offensive", "defensive" or anti-tank.

I should note that the effective radius of defensive grenades is greater than one can reasonably expect to throw them, so do remember not to use them indoors. If you need to use a grenade to clear something out, you should be using an Offensive grenade. Defensive grenades are what the people inside are going to throw at you if you dally around too long. :remygrin:

Ed: added a couple more incendiary grenades, including the venerable molotov cocktail. No list of explosives is complete without it. :remycute:

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PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2009 6:10 pm 
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Sildar wrote:
For example, we've had confirmation from the devs that automobiles exist, but no in-game examples have been provided. We do, however, have a rough technology level, and we can extrapolate from there.

Are you pondering what I'm pondering?

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PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2009 6:17 pm 

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Malantha wrote:
Are you pondering what I'm pondering?


I think so, Mal, but how are we gonna get Fuseli and Islo to dance the Can-Can?

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PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2009 6:20 pm 
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Sildar wrote:
Malantha wrote:
Are you pondering what I'm pondering?


I think so, Mal, but how are we gonna get Fuseli and Islo to dance the Can-Can?

Well that wasn't quite what I was thinking, but maybe if we spiked their grog with 'nip...?


Anyway, someone needs to stage an epic car chase in RP. It would be so unexpected and yet so very awesome.

Wait, if we have cars and 1940s tech, does that mean we can also have tanks?

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PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2009 6:25 pm 

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Highly unlikely. Skytopia probably developed very differently from Earth, post-Upheaval. Aviation tech and its related and dependent techs are relatively advanced, but land-bound tech like autos and tech are likely to be lagging, with exceptions in mining and refinement.

For example, automobiles are canon'd at 1920s-era tech, but our planes our clearly in line with what was available in WWII, with a few advances that occurred much later (owing to our lack of jet engines).

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PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2009 6:30 pm 

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Malantha wrote:
Anyway, someone needs to stage an epic car chase in RP. It would be so unexpected and yet so very awesome.


Promise me you'll have Thompsons with drum magazines. :smile:

Malantha wrote:
Wait, if we have cars and 1940s tech, does that mean we can also have tanks?


Theoretically maybe, but transporting them by air would be problematic if larger numbers were required, and tanks would probably be impractical for most skylands, even if they're a lot larger than they appear in the game. I suppose something like the Tetrarch might be possible though.

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PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2009 6:34 pm 
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Regarding autos,
In his guide to the Earthen Sanctuary, Lynx Adorienne mentions a motor carriage that runs between Lincean College and central Lhasa


http://skyrates.net/forum/viewtopic.php ... ght=#68753

That always struck me as a good tech fit

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PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2009 7:14 pm 

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Wah! Spamming my own thread! :fear:

Added a bunch more submachineguns, courtesy of a list on Wikipedia that was handed to me by a fellow red. Suffice to say there should be a very familiar face on the bottom of the SMG list. :remywicked:

Ed: More rifles, assault rifles, battle rifles and machineguns have been added. Whilst the machineguns are technically not all man portable, they are kept for reference purposes. MGs have been loosely split into three subcategories; light machineguns, medium/general purpose machineguns, and heavy machineguns.

Ed 2: Semi-auto pistols is looking a bit lonely, a little assistance, people?

Ed 3: Got a few more pistols in, but the category is now 66% german handgunnage. :fear:

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PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2009 9:36 pm 

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Quote:
Example: I have in the past (only once though) RP'd with a .50 sniper rifle. Technically they didn't exist until fairly recently in firearm history. This isn't because we couldn't make them in the 40's, instead it's a case of no one seeing a need for one until much later. The 50 BMG round (used in the M2 from WW2) turned out to be a great sniping round, something only discovered in the Vietnam era. So while we had the capability to create .50 cal rifles, it was simply lack of motivation that kept us from producing them. Does this lack of motivation exist in skyrates? That's tough to say, but I do know that the skytopian manufacturing capabilities are comparable to the same real life time period that could have put out a 50 cal sniper rifle.


I don't know if it is true, but supposedly some people tried using anti-tank rifles to snipe people back in those days, and I take it they had little success in the process (It is also funny how COD: World at War tries to depict the PTRS as a sniper rifle. :remygrin ). I suppose that the British Boys anti-tank rifle comes somewhat close to .50 caliber (12.7mm) in diameter with a 13.9X99mm cartridge.

I am guessing that we are around the 1930's to 1940's at the latest for weapons development. I did some haphazard character development in the past, where my character developed a self-loading rifle that obviously borrows from the SKS in some aspects.

The Tokarev SVT-40 (USSR) was also forgotten in the original list. :razz:

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PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2009 9:49 pm 

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Axel Nagant wrote:
The Tokarev SVT-40 (USSR) was also forgotten in the original list. :razz:


Added, along with a spattering of other rifles. I'll probably clarify the rifles list into bolt action, semi-auto and sniper rifles in the near future similar to the way I have with the machineguns, simply because there's so many of the bloody things.

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PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2009 11:33 pm 

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Sildar wrote:
Highly unlikely. Skytopia probably developed very differently from Earth, post-Upheaval. Aviation tech and its related and dependent techs are relatively advanced, but land-bound tech like autos and tech are likely to be lagging, with exceptions in mining and refinement.

For example, automobiles are canon'd at 1920s-era tech, but our planes our clearly in line with what was available in WWII, with a few advances that occurred much later (owing to our lack of jet engines).


Keeping in mind the differences in technological advancement put forth by the game cannon, are we correct in taking the 1940's as our base for these weapons. Given the extensive use of aircraft and the relatively small ammount of land mass to fight over, it appears that virtually all battles would occur either in planes or defending against planes.

Granted, there is the posibility of covert troop transport, but given the lack of helecopters, either they must land at an enemy controlled landing strip, or draw attention from the local governing body before they set foot on the ground. In either case, the authority will destroy the plane at the first sign of hostility and we again return to plane vs. plane combat. Since a bunch of guys carrying firearms is generally considered a sign of hostility, the weapons would have to be concielable to allow troops to get on the ground.

All this means we might still have some pre-upheaval shotguns and rifles kicking about, but most peoples primary weapon is going to be on their plane.

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PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 12:15 am 

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Pedestal Guy wrote:
Keeping in mind the differences in technological advancement put forth by the game cannon, are we correct in taking the 1940's as our base for these weapons. Given the extensive use of aircraft and the relatively small ammount of land mass to fight over, it appears that virtually all battles would occur either in planes or defending against planes.

Granted, there is the posibility of covert troop transport, but given the lack of helecopters, either they must land at an enemy controlled landing strip, or draw attention from the local governing body before they set foot on the ground.


Paratroopers at night, duh. Alternately, use combat planes to land small combat groups, since they clearly have plenty of cargo space, and the armour to handle anti-air fire from the ground. Unless defenders are packing rocket launchers or heavy AA guns that can angle down to hit planes on the runway, there's no hope of stopping them.

Pedestal Guy wrote:
In either case, the authority will destroy the plane at the first sign of hostility and we again return to plane vs. plane combat. Since a bunch of guys carrying firearms is generally considered a sign of hostility, the weapons would have to be concielable to allow troops to get on the ground.


Strafe and/or bomb defensive emplacements whilst establishing air superiority. Then all they have is ground forces. Admittedly you're not in a very good position on the offensive until you can secure a proper LZ for planes, but without anti-air to stop them, the offenders can simply keep dropping more troops. Hell, even with anti-air, that won't stop them from doing mass-landings behind enemy lines.

Ed: Mnah. First post updated with a bunch of description stuff and subcategorization of rifles.

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PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 7:16 am 
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I certainly agree that plane combat is the pre-eminent form of warfare in skytopia. That doesn't mean that ground combat stagnates though. You still need to get boots on the ground in order to control a skyland. There will inevitably be conbat between two opposing infantry forces on a skyland. Even if the defenders planes are shot down, they won't just hand over the place.

For more examples, just think of all the player made RP involving foot combat. There are countless scuffles at the R&P tavern, larger skirmishes like the Teaches raid on Islo, and even multi-day battles such as the Seige of Islo.

I'd think that there are some advanced tactics for landing troops onto a skyland to take it over. Think Normandy or the Pacific Islands, but in the sky. Obviously gun emplacements and defenders will fight back, but skylands arn't 100% defensible. It also isn't a requirement to have total air superiority over a battle zone. Perhaps large wings of aircraft escort troop carriers into the runways/airfields for deployment under fire. Hopefully for the attackers, their own planes and soldiers can keep the defender's heads' down long enough to establish marginal control over a beach head. Hopefully for the defenders, their planes, guns, and soldiers can mount an effective counter attack before they get pushed off the skyland.

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