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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2009 12:26 pm 
Noted Explorer

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I concur that if you wish to focus on trade, you should be able to make money at a comparable rate than doing pure combat. Actually, you should make money at a faster rate since a combat plane can still trade while fighting, whereas a trade plane (with no combat upgrades) may be sore pressed to win high or even medium level combats without great risk to its cargo.
The fact that risky plots are even more effective at generating combats than hunts (which are ostensibly how you are supposed to look for fights) makes the profitability of flying a combat ready plane even more overwhelming. I am actually of the opinion that Navis should allow only Normal and Safe plots and that enhanced combat frequency should only be available through hunting. Of course I am certain that this would be strongly opposed by pretty much everyone else who does any amount of combat.

Fex

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2009 6:12 pm 
True Friend

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Related to what I said in another thread - combat + trade is really great, and that's a problem.

There are plenty of complaints about trade pilots suffering really heavily from combat losses (good!), but combats planes can do both well. Hm?

So, take away the trade part from combat planes. Nix the cargo down to something like...10 stock cargo across the board (+ some variation among tiers, but for the sake of argument...). There are plenty of cargo upgrades to get you back up to current stock cargo, but at least then you'll be suffering with some negatives impacting your trade ability.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2009 1:23 am 
Dev Eyepatch

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Shadowflit wrote:
So, take away the trade part from combat planes. Nix the cargo down to something like...10 stock cargo across the board (+ some variation among tiers, but for the sake of argument...). There are plenty of cargo upgrades to get you back up to current stock cargo, but at least then you'll be suffering with some negatives impacting your trade ability.

And while we're at it, give all trade planes a single S arc in the back, and basically remove cargo bays and guns from all perf planes, let all types focus on what they do best, and nothing else!

All in all, the balance between trading and fighting is a bit borked at the moment. It used to be in 2.3 that you could make equal amounts of money doing either, and a bit more doing both. Not so in 2.4, and the balance is even more skewed in the combateer's favor in 2.5, so far.

In 2.3, you had your trade planes, then you combat planes which were decent traders but not-quite-as-good-at-it, and your perf planes which were basically poor traders. In 2.4 this balance was reversed and perf planes traded circles around combat planes. I haven't looked at th numbers yet for 2.5, but even if combat planes are back as second-best traders in the game, completely destroying their trading ability isn't going to make the balance any better, as long as the massive difference between combat-reward and trade-profit isn't addressed.

Seriously: I make quite a few times more money doing all the combats on a trade route than I make with the trade. Basically the only reason I fill my hold up with tradegoods (When I'm at the computer, that is) is because, hey, the hold is there, and why not use it?

But there are deeper issues at hand here than the size of a combat plane's trade hold.

However! This thread is about combat balancing, not trade balancing.

My experiences so far: The reloading adds a layer of strategy to the combat that simply wasn't there before. You need to manage your ammo during a fight. I like this.

I'm currently sporting a howie and a longarm on my phantom. Haven't experimented with other weapon types yet, but I will. My experience with this setup is that - while I do need to focus my attention to a single plane at a time, that plane then goes down in a hurry - regardless of what it is. So, no more mowing down vast numbers of planes, but precision stalking which satisfies the axe murderer in me, rather than the machine-gun toting rambo.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2009 9:28 am 

Joined: Sat Jun 13, 2009 5:44 pm
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Howitzers now make everything go 'kablooey' nearly instantly, after one or two shots regardless of plane type. Flaks and Autocannons are... laughable.
I agree that trade is practically useless and super hard to get TP in. Why, I got over 500 combat points in one day, and... 3 TP in that day. Trading is /not/ a good way of making money.


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